Thursday, 12 July 2012

SWTOR - Optimal Tanking Gear Guide


I've been asked a lot "What is the best way to gear my tank" - or "What are the percentages that I should be targeting".  I'm asked this both in and out of game and no one really seems to have the answers.  I've never had the answers either - I've just gone with what "felt" right.  Apparently it's worked because people come to me for advice - yay!

Anyway - to combat my ignorance I've tried to figure out what kind of gearing solution will provide optimal "tankyness" (TM).  What I have discovered, is that trying to figure out how to optimally gear a defensive tank sucks - not to fear, I do have results and information to share!

First I determined which stats I would be focusing on - since we're looking at a defensive tank that includes: Endurance, Defense, Shield, Absorb.

This became a problem as I started to examine PvP effectiveness, so I've seperated the categories into PvE and PvP.  Many of the theories are the same, so I'll outline those here first.

Contents


General Info


Endurance -
Makes you harder to kill by giving you more life.

Defense -
Dodges/deflects attacks mitigating all damage.  High Defense leads to spiky damage.

Shield -
Procs the absorb rating to mitigate a percentage of damage.  High Shield leads to even damage.

Absorb -
Amount of damage absorbed when shield procs.  High Absorb leads to even damage.

Terms

AC - 
Advanced Class.  Generic term for referring to all classes as a whole.


DPS -
Damage Per Second.  The average amount of damage inflicted on any given 1 second period.

EDPS -
Effective Damage Per Second.  I will use this to refer to the equation (DPS - MPS)

HPS -
Heals Per Second.  The average amount of healing done on any given 1 second period.

MPS -
Mitigation Per Second.  This is used to compare with DPS in calculations.

PvE -
Player Versus Environment.  Any time a player is killing a NPC.

PvP -
Player Versus Player.  Any time a player is killing another player.


TTK -
Time To Kill.  How long it takes a player to die.

Time To Kill

The first thing I want to discuss is the TTK, which was the first thing that I looked at and what everything else is based from.

The first thing I did was break down the differences between the three tank classes (please forgive me for using republic terminology, I've tried to do the "one/two" thing but invariably I end up using the republic terms at some point.  Guardian = Juggernaut, Shadow = Assassin, Vanguard = Bounty Hunter) in terms of Defense, Shield and Absorb.  Each AC has unique skills that make these percentages completely unique to that class.

(One of the things that made all these calculations so difficult was the difference in ACs.)

I then determined (using the appropriate formulas) what each single point of gain would give each class in terms of actual percentages.  My goal at this point was to use these percentages to find the obvious winner when it came to TTK and gear appropriately.

Normally I could set up a matrix and just compare one stat to the other as they increased to see what happened.  Unfortunately with three stats that isn't as simple any longer - especially when each stat directly affects how each other stat functions.  For example:

High Defense means you will dodge more attacks, rendering shield less "effective" because less attacks are making it through to proc the shield chance.


High Shield will make Absorb more useful because more attacks will proc the absorb percentage.

The inverse is also true with both stats, so comparing them individually was pointless.  Instead I looked at each stat independently, assuming that with 0 points in any other stat (using only the base numbers for each class) what kind of effect will each stat give.

I was only slightly surprised with the results.

TTK Charts


Shadow TTK Chart
JG TTK Chart
Vanguard TTK Chart

What the Charts Mean

One of the reasons we are measuring TTK rather than hard mitigation is because we want to look at the Endurance stat in addition to defensive stats.  Endurance doesn't offer mitigation, instead it offers a larger health pool - we'll discuss how this works more in depth further on.

Each chart is similar with only slight differences.  For Shadows Shield is pretty static purely because of their active shielding buff which ups the shield percentage by a hard amount.  When this is factored in, adding more points to shielding does not have a large effect.  In addition, Absorb has the highest effect for them than any other class.

Guardians have a high curve to the Defense stat, which means they get more benefit from it than any other.  This is partly because they get almost no bonuses to any other stat, and in the end Defense is king when it comes to total mitigation ( when we start looking at big numbers anyway).  We also see their absorb and shield are much closer than the Shadow because of that lack of bonus.

Vanguards have the most interesting table because their defense stat drops significantly.  Note that the Endurance stat is not "more" useful, instead the defense stat is just that much "less" useful.  This is because Vanguards start with such low defense and get almost not bonuses, while their shielding stats get significant bonuses.  Overall increasing any defensive stats on a Vanguard all have lower benefit than for any other class.  Which makes sense since they have the highest base mitigation values.

Baseline

Next to begin finding real numbers I needed a baseline to work from.  I determined the baseline beginning with no defensive stats, then with minimal stats, and finally modified it for PvE and PvP damage "real" damage.

The Numbers

Endurance Baseline: 1600
Buffed Health Baseline: ~19300
DPS Baseline: 1000


Defense Baseline: By Class (7-16%)
Shield Baseline: By Class (24-35%)
Absorb Baseline: By Class (20-32%)

PvE Modifier: 80%
PvP Modifier: 20%

Guardian:
Average MPS (based on DPS): 181.28
Average PvE MPS: 145.02
Average PvP MPS: 36.256

Shadow:

Average MPS (based on DPS): 230.56
Average PvE MPS: 184.48
Average PvP MPS: 46.112

Vanguard:

Average MPS (based on DPS): 153.32
Average PvE MPS: 122.66
Average PvP MPS: 30.66

TTK with defense - 15.7% increase
TTK adjusted for PvE - 12.2% increase
TTK adjusted for PvP - 2.7% increase

The Explanation

I pulled the baseline endurance numbers from my characters with some mid-end game gear.  I just wanted a reasonable calculation to look at for a base so I could test what kind of increase in TTK was coming.

The base defensive numbers are from a standard geared tank without any extra points in defensive skills.  I wanted to use this as a baseline to compare against people who wear DPS gear and a shield generator and see what the actual difference in survivability was.

The PvP and PvE modifiers are pulled from averaged information on how much damage can actually be mitigated by defensive statistics.  A while ago I ran all the PvP numbers HERE - recently I saw a post with compiled PvE Operations numbers on bosses which totaled up close to 80%.  I've used that value here because I trust the person that came up with the numbers.  If anyone has a better value to use please let me know and I can re-work the numbers by just punching that into the spreadsheet.

Calculations

WARNING MATH!

Health:
Base Health + ( Endurance * Bonus * 10)
Base Health = 2500 for each character
Base Endurance = 225 for each character
Bonus = 5% from buffs and X% from talents

MPS (mitigation per second):
( 1 - Defense% ) * Shield% * [ ( DPS * Modifier ) * Absorb% ] + [ ( DPS * Modifier ) * Defense% ]
Modifier = Adjusted PvP or PvE value for actual mitigateable damage
DPS = average damage per second


TTK:
Health / ( DPS - MPS )
This is just a very simple formula asking "how long will I live if I'm taking this much damage"


I was asked to provide a spreadsheet that would output TTK based on my calculations, you can find it here if you're interested:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AkxlS0B-JaSKdElRQ0RjUzZxc3l0LW5obTVNR3dHTVE

Where do we go from here? 

In the spirit of math I attempted to compare the numbers and come up with a formula showing the optimal increase of stats for each level and in each situation.  I discovered this was beyond my skill set - I'm not a trained mathematician.  Perhaps someone else can take my data and turn it into formulas, unfortunately that person is not me.  As I mentioned comparing three values that depend on each other is difficult.

(Just fyi, if we assume that there are 800 skill points to be distributed, and each stat has to be compared to all the others ... that is 800 * 800 * 800 = 512,000,000 data points that would need to be compared to their counterparts to find the optimal distribution.)

So - instead of trying to find a perfect formula for all situations I decided to jump to the "real world" gear and see what I could see.

Optimal Gearing

Overall I've never been upset with the gearing on my tanking pieces, I've found them to be accurate to my own picture of what would be optimal at any given time.  Though I have dumped all my accuracy over recent months in favor of other stats - having a bunch of accuracy on my gear made me assume that it was important (it is not).  Campaign/Black Hole/War Hero gear is optimized very well and has almost no accuracy.

I'll be breaking the rest down in sections (one for each AC) and a separate section where I'll discuss my issues with trying to gear properly for PvP.

Cool Fact: 95% of all Campaign/War Hero gear is exactly the same between tank ACs, just swap the word "strength" with "aim" or "willpower".


The introduction of augments has made min/maxing so easy for Tank ACs that there really isn't a reason not to do it any longer.  Adding augments is the single most effective way to bring your stats in alignment with optimal MPS output.  For PvE the only time you would need to swap mods/enhancements is to pick up something with no accuracy and more defensive stats on it.  Since end game gear doesn't have accuracy any longer there is no need to swap mods.

Endurance and PvE TTK

There is no single way to increase TTK faster than by stacking Endurance.  No defensive stat, no matter where you swap them in or out passes the effectiveness of stacking Endurance to keep you alive longer.

With that being said - once you start adding in healing this is no longer the case.

Tanks die when healers HPS (heals per second) can't match the DPS output.  Stacking MPS lowers DPS which makes HPS more effective.  Once HPS matches or exceeds DPS - MPS then stacking endurance will be more effective than adding any other defensive stat.  Since this threshold changes on every fight and is largely unknown stacking as much MPS as possible is generally the best plan.

When this might become important, is when you are trying out new fights and are unsure what kind of DPS output to expect.  Then you might be better of stacking Endurance, which will allow your healers to leave you "unhealed" longer without you dying - thereby allowing your group to learn mechanics and progress farther in fights without a tank suddenly dying because a healer was busy doing something else.

Optimal Augments

I'm not sure why augments were designed how they were, but they are definitely the worst design for tanks that I could think of.  

Crit/Surge/Power/Primary Stat augments all have +Endurance as their secondary stat

Def/Shield/Aborb/Endurance augments all have +Power as their secondary stat

Does this not make sense to the rest of you?  I can understand that they didn't want to give people +Crit and +Power on the same augment, but why are they giving tanks +Power?  The minuscule increase in damage gained does not make up for the huge loss in Endurance that we potentially could have gotten.  

This is one of the main reasons that I've had so much trouble nailing down optimal gearing for PvP.

Shield Rating

When looking at the gear in the game you don't have many options for swapping mods when it comes to tanking gear.  When looking at mods you have 2 options:
End + Absorb
End + Defense

So there is absolutely no way to increase shield rating from modifications.

Similarly with Enhancements you have two options:
End + Shield + Absorb
End + Shield + Defense

So there is no way to limit your shield rating in favour of other stats because you are required to take shield rating to get any other type of stat.  This leads to shield rating being the only static stat on all end game gear for tanks.  You are required to take X amount of shield rating.

There are a few minor differences in the modifications - for example you can sacrifice endurance to gain a bit more secondary stat, or sacrifice some secondary stat to gain more endurance.  If you truly want to min/max your MPS rating then you will find the opportunities to sacrifice endurance for defensive stats.  Just remember what I said about Endurance and TTK - there is no way to increase your TTK higher than by stacking endurance.  

For my purposes I believe Endurance is a key component for tanks and I did examine places where I could give up (or get) endurance on certain mods - I never found it to be worthwhile to change them out.

The Vanguard/PowerTech

Tanking Set: Supercommando

Vanguards are the most heavily shield dependant class.  Since they have such low base defense values the amount of benefit they gain per point is drastically reduced.  Their gear is very well optimized, only lacking shield stats but keeping everything else relatively balanced - we see this when it comes to augments, they use all three types of defensive augments whereas the other classes focus on one with a few of a second type.

Stat breakdown is based on a Vanguard in full campaign gear with Black Hole MK-1 Earpiece and MK-2 Implants.

Relics are a great way to customize stats, and for Vanguards using a War Hero Relic of Serenity (+113 Defense) and a Campaign Relic of Shield Amplification (+91 absorb rating averaged over duration) is the way to go.  The shield amplification relic actually gives more benefit if you are being attacked by multiple targets since the limit is duration and not charges.

For this gear, optimal augments are:
8 Advanced Shield Augment 22
2 Advanced Redoubt Augment 22
4 Advanced Absorb Augment 22

Buffed Stats: [bracketed numbers are points invested]
Health: 23851
Defense: [352] 18.41 % (2% from set bonus)
Shield: [690] 57.08 %
Absorb: [465] 56.39 % (+8% with defense screen in combat +3.25% avg from shield proc relic - total: ~%67.6)

TTK Increase over base: 179%
MPS Increase: 322%

These percentages are listed to give you a goal for gearing.  Obviously lower tiered armor will have lower values, but the ratio between the values should stay roughly similar.

% of total point budget
Defense: 23.3%
Shield: 45.7%
Absorb: 30.8%

The Shadow/Assassin

Tanking Set: Survivor

Shadows have an active shield buff that adds 15% shield rating on top of their geared values.  This lets them more easily surpass soft caps (read: diminishing returns) and invest less points in shield to get the same type of benefit.  This makes Absorption more important for them because it has more base effect due to their buff.

Shadows also have the largest base defense between all tanks allowing them to reach higher percentages and get more benefit per point of defense.  This allows them to be the most balanced with point distribution and still keep their percentages in the optimal places.

Stat breakdown is based on a Shadow in full campaign gear with Black Hole MK-1 Earpiece and Implants.

Relics are a great way to customize stats, and for Shadows using a War Hero Relic of Serenity (+113 Defense) and a Campaign Relic of Shield Amplification (+91 shield rating averaged over duration) is the way to go.  Alternatively Shadows could sub in a second War Hero Relic for the increased Defense.  This is purely because their buff to shield rating is less useful against multiple targets and the shield relic is more useful against multiple targets.  Subbing in a defense relic gives approximately the same overall TTK values with a change of about ~0.5% MPS.

For this gear, optimal augments are:
10 Advanced Redoubt Augment 22
4 Advanced Absorb Augment 22

Buffed Stats: [bracketed numbers are points invested]
Health: 23840
Defense: [492] 29.64 %
Shield: [546] 44.91 % (+15% from Buff +5% to buff from set bonus - total: ~60%)
Absorb: [481] 57.02 % (+3.25% avg from shield proc relic - total: ~%60)

TTK Increase over base: 177%
MPS Increase: 238%


These percentages are listed to give you a goal for gearing.  Obviously lower tiered armor will have lower values, but the ratio between the values should stay roughly similar.

% of total point budget
Defense: 36%
Shield: 32.3%
Absorb: 31.6%

The Guardian/Juggernaut

Tanking Set: War Leader

Guardians begin with the lowest shielding stats of all other ACs and therefore end up with the lowest overall stats.  This doesn't mean they are less effective, this analysis does not take everything in to account - it does mean they end up with the lowest overall defensive statistics.

When it comes to stats Guardians are balanced quite similarly with Shadows - the only major difference is the absorb rating is less useful for them because of the lack of bonus shield rating.

Stat breakdown is based on a Guardian in full campaign gear with Black Hole MK-1 Earpiece and Implants.

Relics are a great way to customize stats, and for Guardians using a War Hero Relic of Serenity (+113 Defense) and a the Matrix Cube M7-Y3 seem to give the best stats.  For the other ACs you've seen the use of a Shield relic to boost shield rating, Shadows don't have access to a tanking Matrix cube and the added defense rating for Vanguards is nearly useless since they get more effect from shields.  The reason the Guardian is saddled with a cube is part personal preference (higher other stats), partly because they are less reliant on shielding and partly because it significantly raises their TTK (added endurance).  Optionally you could use a Campaign Shield amplification relic which would boost their absorb %3.25 overall.

For this gear, optimal augments are:
11 Advanced Redoubt Augment 22
3 Advanced Absorb Augment 22

Buffed Stats: [bracketed numbers are points invested]
Health: 23,321 (guardians are the only class that lacks a 3% endurance boost)
Defense: [531] 28.41 %
Shield: [546] 48.91 %
Absorb: [454] 51.95 %

TTK Increase over base: 164%
MPS Increase: 257%


These percentages are listed to give you a goal for gearing.  Obviously lower tiered armor will have lower values, but the ratio between the values should stay roughly similar.

% of total point budget
Defense: 35.6%
Shield: 34.6%
Absorb: 29.6%

Tanks in PvP

This has been a hot topic since players have started "tanking" during PvP content.  There are so many different ways to spec and gear your characters that finding the "optimal" way is basically impossible.  Since each person plays their character differently or sees their role in PvP differently they will gear with that in mind.

The primary discussion between Tanks in PvP is whether to put on defensive gear, or offensive gear.  Many tanks stay in their tanking stance to use Guard, but wear DPS gear because they feel that putting out damage helps their team better than soaking up damage.

The opposite is also true, many are trying to optimize their TTK while sacrificing damage output because they believe that is what helps their team most.

I'm not here to lay this argument to rest (unfortunately) since I'm torn between the two sides of the argument and personally mix in some DPS gear with my tanking gear to get optimal use from my character.  In PvE your role is purely to tank, you have other players filling in the DPS role.  In PvP sometimes you will need to do damage to help your team win, and at other times you'll need to become a wall that the other team has to break down.  To fill both of those roles requires some finesse when it comes to itemization.

Maximizing Defensive Utility

You'll be safe following the same guidelines for PvE gearing and using the same augments to maximize your potential.  I didn't dig through six more spreadsheets to determine optimal Defensive stats (read: real numbers) that you get from end game PvP gear because I didn't think it was worthwhile.  In the end, the stats will look similar (just slightly lower) to the PvE stats.  I think for the Guardian it was a 1% difference (lower) in all three categories.

To Mitigate or not to Mitigate

Because of the brutally steep damage curve in PvP defensive stats lose a huge portion of their effectiveness.  For those that don't know the reason you can read here: http://www.tankingtor.com/2012/03/guides-shielddefense-and-armor.html to see how damage is calculated and what types of damage can actually be mitigated.  For my purposes I've used a 20% modifier for actual damage received able to be mitigated.  For some classes this is closer to 30% and for some classes this is effectively 0%.

Overall what does optimizing defensive stats get you in PvP?
For a Guardian:

TTK Increase over base: 110%
MPS Increase: 255%

Yes, that is only a 10% increase in overall survivability.  So ... what is 10% to you?

The MPS Dilemma

So why does mitigation make sense?  Because PvP is not about straight up 1v1 killing another player, it's a team sport.  Being a team sport you aren't on your own, and neither are they.

The MPS Dilemma starts here:  How much mitigation makes a difference when you are being healed?

Because you will be replenishing your Health over time we can remove absolute health as a limiting factor for TTK.  What makes the difference now is how much HPS you are getting - if your HPS > DPS then you will live forever.  If your HPS < DPS you will eventually die.

What makes you live longer?  MPS

MPS becomes an exponential increase to survivability.  For each second you are receiving heals you are mitigating more damage.  For each second you are mitigating you are able to obtain more heals.

Showing TTK vs HPS - mitigated and non mitigated - DPS 1200
The above graph assumes 1200 DPS, 90 MPS, 20k health.  HPS is increasing along the bottom.  I used 1200 dps to prevent the "undying threshold" where HPS passes EDPS (effective DPS).

I wanted to show the above graph for two reasons.  You can see the exponential increase in TTK when coupled with MPS and heals and how it climbs much sooner and more rapidly than it's counterpart.

The "damage required" curve looks exactly the same.  So in the middle, when it would have taken 50k damage to kill an unmitigated player it would take 62k to kill a mitigated player.  At the end of the curve the damage difference is in the millions.

Showing TTK vs HPS - mitigated and non mitigated - DPS 2000
The above graph is the same thing but with a higher DPS component.  You can more easily see the separation from mitigated and non mitigated damage.  Because the TTK happens sooner here, the separation does not grow as large.  Which is of course the downfall of the MPS curve - if you aren't receiving enough healing the 10% increase in survivability is only 10%.

Endurance for PvP TTK

As I've mentioned a few times, the single best way to increase your TTK is to stack endurance.  In a direct death situation (no heals) nothing else will raise your TTK as far or as fast as stacking endurance.

By removing all your defensive augments and stacking Fortitude augments direction you (as a Guardian) will lose ~8% MPS and gain 13.5% survivability.  Which means your TTK moves from a 10% increase to a 23.5% increase.  That's a huge difference for very little in stats.  Classes with endurance boosts will see an even greater benefit.

The really cool thing about stacking Endurance with your Defensive stats, is that every point of Health you add is also added to your mitigation pool, so you get the benefit of having more health, and the benefit of living longer to mitigate more damage.

In over healing situations (healers can more than make up for the DPS with HPS) having extra endurance makes the job of the healers easier because they have to focus less on you as a target.  The more health you have to soak with the less often you'll need to receive a heal.

We all know in real combat a healer isn't putting out specific HPS on you every second, he's putting a big heal on you every once in a while to keep your health topped off.  Potentially having a larger health pool will allow that healer to get a needed heal off before you die - which is what we all hope for isn't it?

Damage for TTK

Yes, I'll discuss this topic even though it's incredibly hard to quantify.  

The premise - dead people don't do damage.  Which is a good premise, and accurate.


I've actually been seeing this a lot more in Warzones lately.  Teams of high DPS output groups are completely rolling over top of any other type of composition.  Partly this is due to their co-ordination and stacking their damage on single targets.  Partly it's due to the fact that ... dead people don't do damage.


When you look at the direct numbers, it isn't even close.  

Lets say as a tanking character you put out 600 DPS.  A damage focused character puts out 1000 DPS.

You both fight the same damage spec'd opponent (~16k health).

In the end the damage focused character kills them very rapidly (16 seconds) and you struggle along for a while (26 seconds).

The damage character rests for the extra time and overall you have potentially taken an extra 10.5k damage. With optimal mitigation you would need to be fighting for 126 extra seconds to make up for that 10.5k damage.

But wait - lets flip that equation.

(Please note that none of these calculations are taking armor in to account, that will play a larger role when the equation is flipped here and looked at from a DPS trying to kill a tank.  They don't have the same armor rating or hard mitigation values - which generally gives a tank an edge when dealing with a DPS character)

Now we're looking at it from the other side.  The Damage opponent hasn't changed, they're both spec'd similarly and do 1000 DPS so they kill each other at basically the same time ~16 seconds.

The DPS character fighting the tank (mitigation, 20k health) has a harder time and struggles along for 22 seconds before killing him.

The tank doesn't kill the damage character (close though), but has lasted an extra 5 seconds.  This is standing toe to toe and just duking it out, not including any delaying tactics the tank may posess.  THIS is why there is a difference in tanking stats and mitigation and pure DPS numbers.  5 seconds is a long time when you are trying to defend a node waiting for help.

Essentially you have to decide what kind of role you are looking to play.  If you're going for an aggressive attacking role, then DPS is the key to winning.  If you are playing a defensive role, then it doesn't help you as much.

Quit Rambling and tell me what to do

Ok then.  I know you're tired of me talking about the benefits, so here is what I am planning to do.  I don't want to be completely useless in the damage department, nor do I want to give up all my defensive power - so I'll be working down the middle a bit.

I primarily PvP on my Jedi Guardian, so what I say will relate directly to him.  You can use my goals as a guide for yourself to come up with the best overall gearing that fits your own playstyle.  Remember - I told you that there isn't a one size fits all equation to "be the best".  I can tell you what the optimal mitigation values are, but I can't tell that having the most mitigation will necessarily make you the best player in PvP.

I will actually be following my "Endurance for TTK" heading and stacking that to increase my TTK rather than augmenting for defense.

I'm not sure about the rest of the tank sets, but on my Battlemaster War Leader set there was an ample amount of surge - which I supplemented with Crit/Surge implants (Vindicators).  This has given me the ability to hit some nice 2.5 -3k crit numbers.  I don't want to lose those, since they really help in a pinch.

My plan is to fill up on War Hero War Leader (tanking gear) with a Bulwark earpiece and implant, and to sub in one Pummeler implant (Surge/Power).

Then I'm going to stack 4 Surge augments (this brings me to ~66%).  Stacking surge augments actually increases my TTK by stacking endurance for me passively.  Remember when I was saying that augments are weirdly itemized?  Well I can use that to my advantage.  I actually think BW might have considered tanks using augments to power up for damage instead of swapping out main gear pieces.

I'll be stacking 7 Might augments (Main Stat + Endurance) for the added damage and crit boost, and in my last 3 spots I'm putting pure Fortitude augments to up my Endurance just a bit more (these boost my power a bit as well).

I'm debating on swapping out some of the might (or Fortitude) augments for Crit augments instead.  My crit will sit at 20% with what I'm estimating currently, which is 5% lower than where it is now.  I'll have to play a bit to see if that makes a big difference.  If it does I'll make the decision on where to swap out augments at that point.

Last I've swapped out the mod in my headgear and the enhancement in my leggings for the mod and enhancement from a second set of boots.  The boots have defense rather than absorb on them, so I'm swapping ~40 absorb in favour of defense.  This works for me because my stats were a bit out of what by not using Augments to supplement.  Shadows would want to do something similar, Vanguards are probably fine with the unmodified gear.

I checked if I would benefit swapping out more absorb, but I would not, so just the one extra modification for optimal output.  If you're not planning to augment for damage/endurance don't worry about swapping gear pieces, you'll make up for it with your augments.

So my target stats (Guardian) are:

Damage (Pri): 658.9-820.9
Bonus damage: 334.9

Crit: 20.69 %
Surge: 66.12 %

Health: 21,673
Defense: 23.87 %
Shield: 46.34 %
Absorb: 46.37 %

Please understand that I'm not saying this is the only way to gear your Guardian, this is how I'm planning to gear mine based on all the above information.  My goal here was to help you understand what the difference is between gearing one way or another.

Conclusion

Do what makes you the most effective.  If base mitigation and high DPS output is what makes you happy don't let anyone tell you that you're doing it wrong.  If you're trying to maximize your survivability and optimize your MPS, go for it.

After playing for a while you start to see how things work without having to worry about the math, you'll get a "feel" for what kind of mitigation you're getting on a class by class basis.  Target classes that you have the advantage and stay away from classes that you have the disadvantage.  Sometimes it's as easy as that.





55 comments:

  1. Great writeup :)

    Quick question though. How does internal/elemental (yellow) damage factor into all this? Defence/Shield/Absorb are all for weapon/kinetic/energy (white) damage. This is especially since there are Operations Bosses that do Yellow Damage (Zorn for example and with all the swaps my most recent parse shows ~47% of the damage during the fight coming from him). Yellow damage needs to be soaked and my guess is that more HP is more helpful for that.

    Keep up the good work. I'm a Guardian Tank on the Harbinger as well.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Thank you :D

      Internal/elemental is actually only part of yellow damage. You're mixing up damage types and attack types, they're different. It is actually attack types that you can defend against, and damage types determine if your armor rating applies.

      I went more in depth here: http://swttor.blogspot.com/2012/03/guides-shielddefense-and-armor.html

      But basically, Weapon/Ranged attacks can be mitigated by defensive stats (this is all white damage).

      Force/Tech attacks can not be mitigated by defensive stats (this is all yellow damage).

      Kinetic/Energy damage hits your armor, Internal/Elemental does not (though you do have a secondary damage resistance to these, tanks are around 20% buffed).

      When I talk about my "modifiers" for PvP and PvE what I'm discussing is the real world damage that is mitigateable. All my calculations take that in to account, as I said for some fights it is higher than others - for my PvE (operations content) I have it set for 80% overall damage between all bosses is mitigated. In Denova this is less because of how the fights were designed.

      And yes you are correct, the only way to soak elemental damage is with a larger health pool. What you have to decide is how much of a health pool you need. I mean - if you're dying lots because your healers are struggling - more health might be helpful.

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  2. As the poster above said - you need to keep your endurance high for elemental/internal damage bosses like Zorn or (even more so) Stormcaller. For Jugg the Def sweet spot is 27%. I understand that this stats are based on MK-1 set but in that case you should augment for endurance and sacrifice some mitigation - 20959 health is way off.

    But all in all, great read and lots of work put in it. Thank you.

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    1. Thanks for pointing that out Vand,

      I went back and checked and was missing the 225 base endurance in my calculations for the Guardians. I've updated that now. Their health base with the gear I was looking at (campaign with MK-1 augments) is 23,321 - I should have noticed since that's about what my Guardian is at currently.

      Delete
  3. How do you feel about on-use PvE relics? I've been doing some theorycrafting for my PT Tank, and I feel like the shield-absorb on-use relic is worth the loss in mitigation for "mitigation when you need it".

    Thanks for posting this, this is a great alternative approach to the mmo-mechanics spreadsheet.

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    1. Hi Gordon,

      Overall you will get less benefit from them, even if you are using them every time the cooldown is ready - which is why when we are doing math and looking at "optimal" they'll fall short.

      What I have used them for in the past (and will continue to use them for) is on boss fights where I know there will be heavy damage periods that I won't always have a defensive cooldown ready for.

      As a PT you will run in to this more often because you only have a single defensive cooldown for those situations - some fights could benefit from 3 defensive cooldowns. So for some fights I would still recommend getting an on-use relic and swapping it in. You've basically said it yourself, sometimes "always on" average mitigation isn't as good as high mitigation "when you need it".

      Delete
    2. Yep. I guess for me personally there isn't much besides boss fights that requires optimal tank gearing to that extent. It looks like you might have a type-o in the PT portion where you say the Campaign Relic of Shield Amplification raises shield, when it actually raises absorb, as is shown in the calculation after. What's the math on the +91? Isn't it 405 Absorb * .3 (6 out of every 20 seconds) = 121.33 Absorb?

      Delete
    3. Thanks for pointing that out, you are correct it should have been absorb not shield.

      I was looking at "effective uptime" so I subtracted 1 GCD from the 6 seconds, since you have to proc for it to happen, the next attack won't be landing immediately which means you lose effective uptime. There are circumstances where attacks are happening faster than once every 1.5 seconds, but in general I found it was a good average to use for comparison.

      Bumping it up those extra points didn't affect any calculations more than 0.5% - if you rate it higher, swapping out an absorb augment for a defense augment equalizes the equation.

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    4. That makes sense. So it's (6 - 1.5)/20 * 405 = 91.

      For what it's worth, I completely agree with you about endurance being perhaps the strongest source of 'tankiness' in PvP. It's lead me to a different conclusion though. I would rather have a full set of tank gear with max endurance and optimized tank stats and a full set of dps gear for when I need it than have 1 set of gear that is kind of tanky, kind of more dps. Personal preference I suppose.

      Delete
    5. Yes that's exactly what I was looking at for the equation.

      PvP is really where individuality shines. For me mixing up my gear a bit fits my playstyle the best, for you - having two separate sets of gear does it for you. That's what makes games fun, we're all unique.

      Finding a gear style that works for you is half the battle. All I can really do (and all I want to do) is show you how things work out and let you make an educated decision.

      Delete
    6. Yep, and thanks again for the great article(s). If you can, it would be great to see the gear sets and spec/talent builds that you're arriving at in the form of askmrrobot or one of the other builders.

      Delete
    7. You're in luck Gordon, I actually did a lot of my stat comparisons with askmrrobot character building so I have those all done up.

      Shadow: http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/character/add89165-71f7-4f88-9908-e2ac8a32f641

      Trooper: http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/character/7ee95c9c-2c03-4704-a34a-8528d6772411

      Guardian: http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/character/afae2a7a-1de6-48c5-bc2c-23139665cd3f

      The gear will all be under the "Wish list" tab.

      Delete
  4. For the sin tank you're missing the self-healing that they can do, which is based off of total health. Therefore the preferred stack there is the Fortitude Augment that is heavy on Endurance, as well as the endurance heavy mods whenever possible.

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    1. I purposefully left the self heals off because they're supposed to make up for the difference in armor and direct DR not secondary stats. Though I guess there is some bleed over because I'm talking about endurance.

      It's an 8% heal in total right? So stacking 14 Endurance augments you will gain 201.6HP over what you would get otherwise.

      You have to stack at least 3 Harnessed shadows to get any benefit, this takes a minimum of 4.5 seconds, and likely more like 6 - 7.5 seconds to prepare. Then 4 seconds of cast time. So that is an extra 201.5 HP / 10-11 seconds. By stripping all your defensive augments you lose 29.4 MPS. Over 10 seconds that is a loss of ~294 mitigated damage.

      So actually you're probably reasonably close in comparison since the endurance will boost your TTK. If you're not worried about maxing our your MPS then going this route is definately an option. For some fights that don't allow you to mitigate as much damage this would be a better option. In general I would stick with your MPS unless your healer isn't having any issues.

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  5. I may have missed it when I was skimming through but would you be able to make available a Laguna-style spreadsheet that includes endurance and outputs TTK?

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    1. It took me a while to put something together, you can find it here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AkxlS0B-JaSKdElRQ0RjUzZxc3l0LW5obTVNR3dHTVE

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  6. Such a great article, I have pointed all the tanks in the guild I am in at this article.
    I am curious about the comments about accuracy on gear. I dropped it all off when re-moding and dropping in all 61 mods etc. I have been using log parsers to look at my tanking data since then and noticing about ~8% miss rate, mostly this is with Strike but it is also with Guardian Slash (3/17 miss rate on one Nightmare Pilgrim run). I dont seem to be having threat issues though. Could you possibly elaborate a little more on why you believe that accuracy is not important? I have noticed a missive pick up in my avoidance since dropping accuracy (up to around 40-45% which is up by about 5%).
    Should I be concerned about the loss in threat when I am missing 8% of the time?

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    1. Sure Matt, I'll go ovoer my reasoning.

      I haven't parsed my data, but that sounds appropriate based on what we assume Boss avoidance is. There are a few reasons why I don't believe it matters at this point in time.

      First - everyone is in the same boat, no one gives accuracy the time of day because they believe hitting harder (but potentially less frequently) is better than any other alternative. DPS will all swap accuracy for power and we all sit around the same base miss percentages. Therefore threat lost from missing is equalized across all classes.

      Second - threat is trivial after a certain point of a fight when using taunt with regular damage rotations. This is because taunt raises your threat level so high that you could stand there doing nothing and still maintain threat. Therefore missing infrequently has absolutely no overall bearing on threat retention and is an acceptable loss. Many later fights involve tank swapping or taunt switching and threat is built up even faster.

      Third - Staying alive longer and being easier to heal means more successful fights in the long run. Sacrificing accuracy for defensive statistics makes sense when your job is to soak damage and not to dish it out.

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    2. Thanks mate, much appreciate the reply. I had come to point three on my own and was the reason I dropped accuracy, it just so happened your article dropped at the same time :)

      Delete
  7. Nice work Rich, I enjoyed the read!
    I have cut down my pve tank guardian's defense alot in favor for near max endurance. Fully buffed I am currently at 26.3khp, 25%def 45%shield 45% absorb and I have really found it to be much better.
    That full Black Hole gear with Campaign relics and some min/maxing with specific BH mods like the 57 end ench and the 53 end mod.

    So for what its worth, I really advise many tanks to stack that endurance. My guildie is an equal geared Vanguard who has better def stats but lower endurance we our damage taken is within 2-3%, so the def stats really are not performing as I would have liked so endurance it is!

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    1. Hi Nony,

      Thanks for your additions. In PvE I see endurance as less important because your healer will be healing you up to full health basically all the time. Having enough endurance to survive the high damage spike areas is important (with a buffer) but after that point it makes your healer's life easier if you stack defensive stats. Even 3% is 3% less output your healer needs to be worried about. This value is also relative, in EC bosses are less reliant on weapon damage so the values will come closer together due higher damage coming from damage that bypasses defenses.

      Also keep in mind comparing a Guardian and Vanguard won't net you the right numbers since the Vanguard is going to be mitigating more damage over time (higher shield, lower dodge) which makes them even the damage out - and your Guardian will be taking more spike damage due to high defense. So while the damage over time might equalize you are in more danger of dying as the guardian due to lack of hard mitigation at critical points. The extra endurance is giving you a larger buffer for that spike damage but you've passed up ~5% defense which is a huge difference in damage intake. In the end since we're really talking about minor changes (augments mostly) the differences will be minor enough that both avenues are viable since primarily you're relying on base stats anyway.

      Weighting the differences and making a decision based on personal preference and playstyle was what this guide was about.

      Delete
    2. Xzyzz(Fatman)23 July 2012 18:42

      Well as a guardian, I have access to the best defensive CDs and they last longer with the set bonus. So if/when things get hairy poping a rakata medpak and a fast refresh defensive CD does the trick, while still having 2 other kick ass CDs on reserve.

      So hard mitigation at critical points as a guardian is very controllable. With Saber Ward / Warding Call / Endure / Rakata Armor Adrenal & Medpack it just takes some anticipation and timing.

      Delete
  8. Along the lines of "Quit Rambling and tell me what to do" can I get some guidance on a 50 Power Tech Shield Tank for PVP? What would you do? I'm only 45 but I want to make sure I'm ready. I should have maxed out Ranked Warzone credits at 50th.

    I love the Jet Charge/Grapple combo, this is what makes the game fun for me.

    In PVP I play as a disruptor/distractor/debuffer/Guard and some DPS as part of the distraction process. I've gotten 16 medals once and steadily get 9+. I move around a lot and on average get at one MvP vote every other game I play.

    If I'm not guarding/debuffing I do my lunge into an enemy group, 2 free flame sweeps (debuff), oil slick(debuff). If I take aggro I pop shield + kolto heal. If there are 3+ player I hit them all with more flame sweeps or I just use flame bursts(debuff), and the normal rocket punch, rail, combos.

    I am running a 31/7/2 build: (currently 31/3/2) - I realize this has more DPS than it should, where should I shift the points? Should I take those 2% damage reducers? Do they make any difference?

    swtor.askmrrobot.com/skills/powertech#8k6c2dej8e-12-c

    Gear slotted for Shield/Defense/Absorb and a tiny bit of Accuracy and Crit

    Stats at 45th level:
    12% Defense (13 in pvp)
    38% Shield (40 in pvp)
    38% Absorb (41 in pvp)
    20% Tech Crit (21 in pvp)

    Thanks!

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    1. Hi Rico,

      I too enjoy having both a leap and a pull on my Vanguard, particularly in PvP where positioning is so important.

      I am running a 31/7/3 build that you can see here if you clikc the "current build" link at the very top. You should definately grab the endurance talent, nothing ups your TTK more than straight endurance. Extra damage on rocket punch is just not the same. I haven't played with the immobilize from grapple in pvp, it might be worth it, but I feel like the points are better spent on Ion screen or finishing off your ion cell talents.

      In PvP it sounds like you have it right, you're there to kind of debuff/soak damage where possible. Particularly on a healer. If you aren't guarding a healer guarding a high output DPS class will be beneficial.

      When you do jump in, make sure you are assisting another player and not trying to pressure someone on your own. The likelihood of you killing someone before you die is quite low. It's rare that you'll get in the middle of melee combat and not have at least 2 people hitting you.

      If there is one thing I can say about hitting 50 and starting to PvP, is that it's OK to die. It's OK to die a lot actually - thats basically your job. Don't worry about putting up big damage numbers, focus on playing for your protection score and be team oriented. Guard objectives where you can (hopefully with help). Tanks are the best node defenders in the game, being able to call for help and live long enough for help to arrive are priceless. Take care of your healers and they'll take care of you.

      In the end Rico it sounds like you have the right attitude, I think you'll do just fine.

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  9. Wow, thanks for all the great advice.

    swtor.askmrrobot.com/skills/powertech#8k6e8de26k-c32-30

    My new build: I maxxed out Ion Overload and added Super Charged Ion Gas (for the Rail AoE that I can add to my flamesweep AoEs). I added the +3%endurance, two +2 damage resists and dropped the +9% Aim (is that ok?) and +3%Railshot. I do have the +6% Flame damage because I use Flame much more than I do Railshot.

    Yea, I love the +immobilize for Grapple in PvP, it's adding insult to injury pulling players back 30 meters and putting them on time out for 3 seconds great when they are trying to finish off a friendly player and suddenly out of the fight, oh they get so mad xD

    Yea I do die a bit but I do good disrupts, save my teammates and run delaying actions effectively :-)

    Roughly, how much more survivability will I get with the 4% damage reduction and +3% endurance add?

    Also I hear at level 50 I should be shooting for 16% defense, 50% shield, 50% absorb, does that sound right to you?

    Thanks again!

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    1. Hey again Rico,

      My pleasure, glad I can help out. It sounds like you've reasoned through your build pretty well. The loss in Aim will be more or less noticeable for your damage output depending on how things go. I haven't found a way to max this talent yet so we're in the same boat - I believe damage is the last thing to worry about anyway.

      Well 4% DR will give you roughly a 4% increase in survivability. The 3% endurance will depend on your base, but it will be significant at higher gear levels.

      You'll be fine around 45%ish absorb because of your active boost. The rest looks reasonable. Really it's gear dependent, when you can augment for what you're lacking. I went over all the ratios in the guide if you want something more specific.

      Delete
  10. what is your take on pvp relics for war hero. Gaurdian defense tanking with a focus in how you were talking about. I am currently using the relics of Imperiling serenity x2 with fort augments in them. for the boost in def that we lose. whats your take on the end and shield proc one?

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    1. I'm using 1 Serenity relic and my Matrix Cube on my Guardian since I feel that the cube gives me the best benefit of both offense and defense for the slot.

      For a purely defensive standpoint the second Serenity relic is the way to go, nothing is better in that slot. Guardian gear is lacking a lot of Defense on the PvP set and that should make up for it.

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  11. As for your stance on specing into the tree i did not really see anything. Question: Since there is a base 5% block for people. Would you spec into the 3% accuracy for guardian pvp tanking so you don't miss all the time to try and stay close to 95% accuracy or just spec that into something else that's useful.

    Also, what is the soft cap or is there a cap for guardian defense? You touch on the optimal amount but Ive done some slight research that says that the way the game decides what hits and what doesn't is based off two rolls and that defense is the first one based off opponents accuracy then shield and absorb are secondary to mitigate if a hit hits. So if a lot of attacks bypass def anyways wouldn't it be more prudent to have a good amount of shield/absorb to mitigate attacks and crits?

    I do age we need to keep some damaged output and that augmenting a bit into str /end is smart since it does both for dmg and for stacking endurance where def might be a mute point after a certain extent. and the TTK increase of stacking endurance is better in the majority of cases.

    * I know there were a few questions in there. sry if it was a bit disorganized. Finally somene to ask and bounce ideas off of to try and theorycraft a bit here.

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    1. If you want to bypass the base 5% defense that everyone has your accuracy would have to be 105% not 95%.

      IMO accuracy isn't as important as other things. Again it boils down to how much damage loss is acceptable when it comes to losing out in other areas. I used to take the accuracy talent, but every time I traded points for something else I didn't notice any difference in overall output.

      "Soft Cap" is the wrong type of term. All stats work on curves, which means the more points you put in to them the less overall benefit you get. This begins at 1 point and continues on through 1000 points. People use the term soft cap in different ways, I've stayed away from it since it doesn't make any sense to me.

      All my calculations are based on the fact that skills have "Diminishing Returns" (the phrase you should be looking for). And everything is compared against eachother at each stage to determine which one has the most benefit at each stage.

      You are correct in the two roll system, I've talked about that elsewhere on here so didn't go in to it on this guide. Nothing that can not be defended can be shielded, mitigation all works on the same attacks. So anything that bypasses your defense will bypass your shields as well. Shields also never block critical hits, the way the rolls are set up they can't.

      A lot of people don't seem to understand how that works, I'm putting it on my list of stuff that I should write a real guide about.

      I'm happy to answer any questions you might have. Thanks for stopping by.

      Delete
  12. Sorry but you fail 100 %accuracy for Guardian/Juggernaut is a must have

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    1. Why? And not just because you saw someone say it once.

      The only place I can find tanking enhancements is in Black Hole Trooper gear. Which is generally worse than campaign items. There are a few pieces that have something like +45end +57acc +22 absorb (or 22 def).

      You need approximately 300 accuracy to reach 100% from base. So that means swapping ~6 enhancements (note, you only have 6 enhancements unless you have orange bracers/belt).

      I ran the numbers quickly. You're giving up a lot of shield to stack accuracy. End game that brings my shield number down to 36% (loss of 13% overall). You also lose ~37 endurance because the mods are endurance light.

      So - can you explain why that extra 10% accuracy makes a tank that much better he can forgo those kind of mitigation numbers? How exactly is that helping the group in any way?

      As a last note, there is no such thing as a (61) PvP tanking ehancement with accuracy.

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    2. My tank stats are(raid buffed) Build (31|10)
      26.3k HP

      100%accuracy
      26.7% Def
      45.7%shield
      47.3% absorb

      we go denova HM with 3 sentinals, they are all about 1800-1900 dps

      without 100%accuracy i had proplemes with my aggro

      PS:sorry for bad english I am from germany

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    3. Can you tell me what you did with your gear? Nothing I can put together even comes close to that. Particularly with the HP that high. Also do you have the Accuracy talent in your 31/10 build?

      My current stats are:
      24.7 HP
      91% ACC
      29.2% Def
      49.41% Shield
      50.08% Absorb

      If I pulled all my augments for Fort ones I could meet your HP numbers, but I'm not sure how you swung 100% acc with only losing 5% shield and where your absorb went. Are you using MK-3 implants by chance?

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    4. 1:Yes I have the Accuracy talent
      2:No I use MK-1 implants

      I have 4 Accurcy augments ,3 Def and 7 end
      And 2 pices with +45end +57acc +22 absorb

      Accuracy base 91%
      Talent 3%
      4 augments ~2.2%
      2 pices ~4%
      = 100,15%

      Delete
    5. Thanks for going over that with me. I didn't think of the Accuracy Augments.

      I'm glad it works for you - personally I haven't ever had issues with threat with any DPS, it's possible that I've never been with DPS that put out those kind of numbers, I don't know for sure.

      You have to admit that your stats (for mitigation) are lower that what I've posted and you will therefore be taking more overall damage. If that matters, or not, is subjective - the purpose of this guide was to show how to optimally gear for mitigation ... if you decide to forgo mitigation for other advantages that is up to the individual player.

      Delete
    6. Year but your Guide is calling "SWTOR - Optimal Tanking Gear Guide" and a "Optimal" Tank need to have aggro with any DPS.

      Wich meens you need 100 % ACC in your Optimal Tank gear

      PS: How much dps did you make in Denova at the first Boss?

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    7. You seem to be under the impression that I lose aggro. I don't, and I have 0% accuracy bonus. Which means that it is 100% possible to roll with 0% accuracy bonus and invest more heavily in defensive stats.

      We can go back and forth on that as much as you like, but it is obviously not "Optimal" to have 100% accuracy if I can do it with 90% and have higher defensive stats. I'm not sure why you think that makes my whole guide wrong, just because you personally have found that added accuracy helps you. I am saying if that works for you, good for you, but you are missing out on mitigation.

      I think last time I ran MOX I was sitting around ~600-650DPS overall across all fights. Something like that. I generally don't parse my DPS because in the end it doesn't really matter.

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    8. Year sorry i think your Tank guide is Nice ,but wihle reading it looks like you where saying that ACC is more or less useless. I just want to add that Acc can help tanks with aggro
      Problems like me.

      Sorry for missunderstanding , as i said my english is not so good



      PS:Ok Your Dps are nealy the same.

      Delete
    9. Xzyzz(Fatman)23 July 2012 18:15

      IMO - If you need 100% accuracy to hold aggro in 1.3, you are either in full defense spec or not using taunt correctly.

      Delete
  13. I am sorry that my question on accuracy caused all of this. I would put it to anyone here that is complaining about what his name of his guide is or if its right or wrong or the validity of what is said to make their own or at least post something to back up your claims.

    mY original question was how important is accuracy in PVP. I figured it wasn't very important since their was no gear with anything on it even to swap out at lv 61.

    As of right now with the spec into the 3% accuracy im at 98% and miss very rarely. My role in pvp is not to pull a ton of damage so the loss in augmenting for accuracy would be pointless. I am going to see if staying at 94-95% will work and get back to you once i finish out my full war hero gear. I am currently missing the ear 2implants the offhand and one relic of serenity. i augmented for with might and saw a huge increase in damage and survivability across many games. I will have to play with augmenting for def in a few slots maybe or so the boot swapping thing for enh. I augmented everything but the pieces im lacking (minus offhand).

    Stats ATM are:
    21332 HP (NO hp BUFF)
    28.85% DEF
    42.26% SHIELD
    41% ABSORB
    98.10% ACC
    WITH DAMAGE AT 631-793
    BONUS DMG : 307.4 (THIS WILL BE INCREASED later)

    I am really only concerned with the accuracy thing right now since I am not fully geared and havn't lost the accuracy for def from the implants and ear piece yet. The other thing i was confused about was why def and shield are in the sane roll can you post a link to where u had discussed this so i can understand better?

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    1. In PvP where threat isn't an issue Accuracy is even less important because people (other than tanks) don't stack defense, so there is always only a 5% base miss chance.

      Once again I'm running 91% accuracy in PvP and not having issues. There are times when something misses that I would have rather didn't miss, but that is never critical in the overalls scheme of how things go in a warzone.

      Defense and shield are not in the same roll - I discuss the game mechanics in the Guardian guide here: http://www.tankingtor.com/2012/02/swtor-juggernautguardian-tanking-guide.html#briefmechanics

      Delete
  14. I find it funny here how these formulas don't include crit chance (which is how tanks die) and which is the reason defense is the #1 stat.

    How the double attack roll is not really addressed for example defense chance of 30% and shield of 42% does not mean you shield 42% of attacks it means out of the 70% of attacks that get through defense you shield 29% of the attacks less crits of course.

    If you want some good information test crit rates for bosses

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    1. Because crit chance has nothing to do with mitigation. There is no boss that has a high enough crit chance that pushes shield chance down. In fact I haven't met a player with > 45% crit chance, and you'd have to be > 40% and fighting a Shadow with his buff up to even notice.

      If you're talking about skills that buff crit chance temporarily, yes, that does hurt. But they don't last long and thats why you have defensive cooldowns.

      All calculations take the double attack roll in to account and only hits that get passed the first roll are counted for the shield mitigation values. Which is why you will see defense weighted more heavily in most places.

      My MPS first counts how much damage is mitigated by defense, then takes the leftover damage and mitigates it by shield rating.

      Delete
  15. The thing is you are not correctly counting shield chance. Because a lot of bosses most annoying attacks seem to crit a very high percentage of the time. These attacks can be mitigated by defense but if they bypass this you get crit.

    A lot of keps attacks seem to have a high crit mod that pushes shielding off the table.

    And yes keps is a great place to burn cooldowns for both tanks but that is besides the point. a 40+50% chance not to get hit with saberward is better then a 27+50% chance not to get hit from lower defense.

    If you want to make a guide like this do the work and log your attempts and find the bosses normal hit and crit rates for different attacks. Then factor that in to the shielding calculations.

    Really just the EC HM bosses need testing though everything else is a cakewalk

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    1. http://www.torparse.com/a/4828

      There is my parse from fighting Kephess tonight. We had a few attempts so there are a few to pick from. Check out the 0% crit all the way down on damage taken. Please do your own research before coming here to give me crap. There is no boss that I've ever found that has a high enough crit chance to regularly push shield off the table.

      I admit I haven't used Torparse very often but it calculates all my pvp incoming crits properly - there is a chance it misses the PvE ones, but I assume they follow the same format.

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  16. Defense: [531] 28.41 %
    Shield: [546] 48.91 %
    Absorb: [454] 51.95 %

    % of total point budget
    Defense: 35.6%
    Shield: 29.6%
    Absorb: 34.6%

    I think it should be
    Shield: 34.6%
    Absorb: 29.6%
    here?

    ReplyDelete
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    1. Thanks Nony, not sure how I reversed those, but there you have it.

      Delete
  17. torparse obviously not recording PVE crits cause well it says you never get crit and that doesnt jive with actual observation

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    1. You know thinking about it, I don't remember ever being crit by a boss. I've tried multiple other sites, none of them report crits on my logs. I suppose it's possible that the logs don't report critical hits - so it'll be impossible to try and include that in any guides.

      If you have actual observation or proof showing that you do get crit by bosses, feel free to let me know how you got it and show me what it looks like so I can replicate it and get actual results.

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  18. By my calculation using a 2nd War Hero Defense Relic on the Jugg and then switching 5 defense augments for Strength would yield 31 more strength, 33 more endurance, and 2 more defense rating and then ofcourse 60 less power.

    If that much power loss is not desired then ofcourse switching some augments of those 5 around would be able to make up for it.

    Just wondering if this is something you overlooked or if you think the power is needed for threat generation (reading your replies to some of the other comments I do not think this is the case).

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  19. so what about mods and enhancements for shadows? or do you just have these numbers for whats in the end game pve gear? Should I favor bh or campaign because of the set bonus?
    like whats a good thing to look at for other gear other than just the augments?

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  20. I know that you have recently left SWTOR, but I just found your sight and have a real general open ended question... In your opinion what is the best overall tank as of 1.3? I have always played dps and thought about giving tanking a try. Thanks in advance...

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  21. Excellent guide. Glad to see you actually do your math, instead of just smashing your opinion around. In regards to your optimal stats for vanguards, when you say buffed, do you mean with or without a stim?

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  22. When it comes to the JK in pvp, I think this guide should be a good reference: http://watchmen.activeboard.com/t50144827/a-whole-guide-for-a-whole-guardian/

    To sum it up, I would try to have around 1200 expertise, and maximize health and def stats, letting shield/abso to come along without searching to maximize it.

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